Communities and Economic Development Cabinet Advisory Board - Wednesday 25 January 2023, 6:30pm - Start video at 0:05:07 - Tunbridge Wells Borough Council Webcasting

Communities and Economic Development Cabinet Advisory Board
Wednesday, 25th January 2023 at 6:30pm 









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1 Chair's Introduction

good evening, welcome to this meeting of the Communities and economic Development Cabinet Advisory Board on Wednesday, the 25th of January 2023 I am Councillor Pope Vice Chair of this Committee.
before we start, please give your full attention to the following announcements by our clog, Mrs. Moran,
thank you, Chair of good evening, everybody.
in the event of the fire alarm ringing continuously, you must immediately evacuate the building at walking pace officers will directly via the most direct available route, and no one is to use the lift, we will make our way to the fire assembly point by the entrance to the Town Hall Yard car park on months away and once outside a check would be made to ensure everyone has safely left and no one is to re-enter the building until advised that it is safe to do so.
this is a public meeting and proceedings are being webcast live online or recording will also be available for playback on the council's website shortly afterwards, any third party may also record or film meetings unless exempt or confidential information is being considered, the council is not liable for any third party recordings.
it is very important that the outcomes of the meeting are clear at the end of each substantive item, the Chair will ask whether the matter is agreed in the absence of a clear majority, or if the chair decides a full vote is desirable or vote will be taken by a show of hands, members should raise their hands to indicate their vote and keep their hand up until the count has been announced, Members requesting a recorded vote must do so before the vote is taken. Thank you Chair,
thank you for the benefit of the recording we're going to take a roll call.
thank you, Chair, expected Members here this evening, Councillor Ellis or isn't Councillor Fairweather.
present Councillor funnel.
present Councillor Hill present, Councillor March, gets her Neville present, Councillor Palmer, present Councillor White present Councillor Pope Britain, and just for the benefit of the recording Councillor effort is not here at the moment, but he is due to join a shortly.
expected officers here this evening, Stuart, Clifton, present.
Gary Stevenson returned Paul Taylor, present B and other Members here this evening, Councillor Ben tablet.
present Councillor planned present, thank you Chair.
thank you, members of the Committee should be familiar with the process, but for the benefit of any members of the public who may be watching, I would like to explain a couple of things committee members have had their agenda packs and have had the opportunity to ask any factual questions of the officers ahead of the meeting when we come to the substantive items on the agenda this evening, the relevant officer will pass it out where report.
we will then move into member discussion.
at the end of the debate, I will try to summarise the Committee's view, and members should ensure that any proposals or actions are correctly captured, I will remind members, without prejudice to any other comments that may be raised, the committee is asked to come to one of the following positions.
that the recommendations to Cabinet or supported by the board
that the recommendations to Cabinet would be supported, subject to a particular issue being addressed, or that the recommendations to Cabinet are not supported, and if this is the case reasons should be stated.

2 Apologies for Absence

item to do, we have any apologies for absence.
we've had apologies from Councillor Fitzsimons this evening Chair.

3 Declarations of Interests

declarations of interest do we have any declarations of interest?
no declarations of interest given.
thank you notification of persons wishing to speak at this time, we note whether any members of the public visiting members of the Council have registered to speak this evening, do we have any such persons?
we have no speakers this evening.

4 Notification of Persons Wishing to Speak

thank you, minutes of the last meeting dated Wednesday, the 9th of November 2022 members are asked to confirm that the minutes of the previous meeting or a true record of the proceedings.

5 Minutes of the meeting dated Wednesday 9 November 2023

please, may I remind members that the only matter for discussion is their accuracy, do Members have any comments?
I see no.
only with any comments, thank you, the motion is to agree the minutes are we agreed?
the motion is carried.

6 Forward Plan as at 12 January 2023

the next item is item 6, the forward plan, as it 12th January 2023, the forward plan is set out on pages 12 to 24 for reference, although any comments or questions for now.
I see none.
so the motion is to note the Forward Plan or we agreed.
the motion is carried.

7 Borough Partnership Plan: Building a Better Borough

so item 7.
is the Borough Partnership Plan Building a better Barrow, this report starts on page 25 of our agenda.
I will pass over to the presenting member to introduce the report, Councillor Ben Chaplin, Leader of the Council.
thank you Chair this item is the bar Partnership Plan Building a better Barra on the 25th of May 2022 new Barrow partnership administration took control at Tunbridge Wells Borough Council that's 246 days ago what this document?
sets out is it lays out a plan for Tunbridge Wells Borough Council between 2022 and 2024, you will find in the document five priorities, which are called the focus on 5, and those are the priorities that we feel the Council can add the most value to residents' quality of life.
the process was cabinets, Members were got to know their Cabinet areas and are now in a position to share their key projects in the document.
it is a live document because, as you can see, there are projects on the completed.
actions and there are future action say it will be a live document once its agreed by full Council the idea of this plan is an interim plan.
as we start preparations for a corporate plan.
which will be ready, hopefully in the next 12 to 14 months, because we never corporate plan to set the longer term direction of the Council, it also sets out our operating principles when we make our decisions as a council, what are the factors we need to consider and it also sets out the stringent financial context that we have, including deficit forecasts in the medium term financial strategy.
I welcome questions from members of the Committee on whether they feel those are the correct priorities or projects which are listed in the plan, thank you Chair.
thank you, Councillor, Sheppard, I think we now move into any questions, are there any questions?
I see Councillor White.
also first question I've got his about, you mentioned in here these on quite a lot of consultation, I just wanted to those a little bit more detail he could provide on that.
yes, sir, we we, we've done quite a few consultations online.
since May we've also been on top, so we've been engaging with residents and quite a quite a lot through those cabinet meetings we've had good attendance at those, and we also.
as part my role, I've been doing quite a lot on back on the shop floor as council leader going to different.
areas, so I've been on the on the been and done the been shift I've been with the street cleansing team, I've done the housing need team.
we've been to parking Crematorium cemetery, call centre police side of the Cs, you.
and we are going to be launching.
in the summer, our borough wide survey, which is one of our future actions as well, once we've gone through the results of the budget consultation that closed last Friday.
thank you.
thank you, are there any more questions?
Councillor Mark, thank you.
I notice in the carbon reduction or future actions and I know that Councillor ever it isn't here, but I wonder if you could help here it, you say to develop a pesticide and herbicide policy, to promote biodiversity and wider being behaviour change is that just on the council owned land or are you intending to go wider and have you been in consultation with the NFU and that's the to people like that?
so my understanding is that the the pesticide and herbicide policies for us as a Borough Council or now on our land to try and include biodiversity.
thank you, and I I'm so slightly flummoxed here, because this has always been known as a timetables Borough Council Plan, and I just wondered why, in fact, you have decided to call it the Partnership Plan, whereas in fact,
I think our residents see it as a borough council plan, could you explain that lies?
yes, so.
I think that's a fair comment and cabinet and I will sit down and have have a review, whether it needs a a new name, but it will be the Tunbridge Wells Borough Council Plan in terms of our priorities, still 2024 waste, we draw up the new five-year corporate plan which will be ready hopefully in the next 12 to 14 months but I take your point.
your Group Leader mentioned it, yes, last night, it was mentioned on Monday night, it was mentioned that overview and scrutiny, and I think cabinet are willing to discuss changing that absolutely the very fair point, thank you.
thank you.
Councillor Wykey of Christian. Thank you. You mention this as a live document which is helpful, because I just wondered if there was a bit more detail that was sitting behind this and when you talk about things like assets you're going to dispose of, but don't mention what those are or progressing the town centre development plan. This all feels like there's a lot of detail that hopefully you've talked through the which you're not share and him, and it's difficult, I think, to form an opinion on what is quite a gas to me for quite a light plan at the moment without offering any real understanding of how you gonna carry out
yes, I think I think that's a fair comment, what we're trying to do is give you a a summary of the projects rather than give you chapter and verse on every single bullet point.
one of the ideas that we have is maybe to link to hyperlink all these projects back to the necessary Cabinet Advisory Board agendas and so on.
Robin kind of have a 500 page document which has got chapter and verse I mean some of the future actions.
are very much in an embryonic stage at the moment and the the plans are thinking behind that is still evolving as we go through.
OK, thank you, and I think that I can see what you're trying to get to growth is quite difficult at the moment, because there's not a lot to this is not a lot of meat to really understand how it's gonna go forward.
OK, I'll post sudden to Councillor Fairweather, thank you Chair.
a thing of of being able to.
watch and listen to the owner's meeting and the meeting on Monday night and obviously I was present last night, so I think most things have been flogged to death and, and you know things have gone back on recommendation as to what the various groups thing.
so I don't intend to go over any of those things again, have already been said and gone through the other cabs, I've just got couple of really basic questions on.
the plans for installation of more CCTV in the car parks and the EV charging points at the first question is if we invest in those projects.
and the assets are sold will we wish to see a return on that investment?
thank you, Councillor, Robert Sacre, same question on Monday night and on my answer, will be that with the EV charging points, I had a meeting on Sunday with someone who is a car industry analyst who tells me that Tesla having to drop the prices of a cars because there is not customers are not coming to them as they would wish because I feel that there isn't enough recharging infrastructure so I think we have to lead the way by installing the EV charging points.
I think once we get to it's going to take a while for us as a as a as an administration to look at which assets we want to dispose of which non operational, that's gonna take a while to work itself through, so we won't be disposing of them tomorrow just after installing either EV charging points or CCTV.
the technology and CCTV moves so quickly in terms of what what the tech can do, but it might well be obsolete by the time we dispose of that asset anyway.
given fuller yeah, just on the CCTV really are we happy that we've got the funds to to implement that plan installing CCTV and also looking slightly broader than that, obviously with the increased number of cameras and monitors etc do you anticipate will be a knock-on effect in in actual operators in the operating centre and and a further cost down the line regarding employment because clearly one or two operators can only do so much work?
so my understanding is those are that those monies have been allocated already.
and my understanding is also that the technology allows those cameras to come online and, because of the way the technology works means that actually you're using artificial intelligence to pinpoint where the problems are, rather than having to monitor 30 screens, some of the monitoring of those that those screens will flag up potential issues for the camera operators without needing to have an extra,
Schumann, monitoring.
thank you.
Councillor White, thank you, that's just brought another question to my mind, and could you talk about here in the document as a user pays and people that use services should pay, so things like that in car park CCTV in EV or that increased car parking fit costs because it feels like that's not something they're gonna use by everybody, so I just wondered how you are going to cover the costs for that.
thank you, the principle of user pays is one that we support, which was actually introduced by Councillor David Duke's when he was Leader, if might recollection, is correct, Councillor March.
what we're trying to say with user pay is that if you use a Council service, you should pay for that service rather than every single taxpayer in the borough paying for it, so if you use an EV charging point, you will be paying for that service through whatever apps ascription you've got to charge in the car park as well as paying your your normal parking charge as a user of that car park.
Councillor Palmer, very.
OK, but I think positive for your idea to sell off some of the assets might be the very places where this CCTV and the EV charging points will be, therefore it won't be the council, benefiting from that money would be whoever you sold the Kolpakova or that area of to show.
it could be.
in terms of the the assets we have, there is a list of assets which are no longer required for operational use, so that's 1 1 routes we need to look at so, for example, it sought out there in the public domain, the Wesley Centre is no longer needed to deliver Council services and pallet wood so that's one way we can dispose of it Councillor Rutland, who is in charge of parking,
wants to have a review of parking.
the strategy for the whole for the whole borough, so once that is done and that will take time, then if we find that there is a surplus for car parking, then we will have to look at whether that is actually an asset that needs to be disposed of, but at this point no decisions have been taken and we will look at it step by step.
Councillor March, thank him.
thank you, Councillor? Châtelot he mentioned that certain assets being disposed of and Wesley Centre in Paddock Wood would I think also t in 2 was mentioned I noticed on one of the reports and I thought it was the residents of that area, maybe Councillor LB can help here her this thought it was the residents of the area who actually wanted to maintain it for coffee and for fees and debt.
they were quite vocal when we had even thought about it once before, maybe you could update me on that please.
frankly, year on Oscar was the Chair because on the only person registered for that, whether it would be acceptable to bring in Councillor pounds to then answer Councillor Marcus?
question because he's got the overview of that, thank you, Councillor Chaplin.
I think we welcome Councillor LB input, thank you, because you are.
yes, Councillor March, the tea and two community centre is an under-utilised, but much valued centre, as you know, in the middle of Sherwood, which is a ward of which I am one of the members.
and the Council pays a fairly significant sum in rent to the freeholder, which is the YMCA in fact, so we have a long lease on the on that property and it is accepted, I think that we are not utilising it as well as we could, therefore there are discussions currently going ahead about whether the YMCA, which has a really quite significant capacity and capability to live to deliver five strands of business whether they might actually consider coming back into that put into that building taking the lease back from us and then driving their own agenda.
for the local community, and that is an enormously positive potential and has already got the engagement because I principally, have been facilitating the discussions when St Philip's Church, where they already have a youth worker.
with the the facilities and South Fields, which also already has a YMCA Youth worker, with Skinners' Kent Academy, with the men's shed and with other voluntary groups, so I think we're we're early in the stages of that discussion, but it is listed as a potential disposal of the lies not of the property itself.
thank you, thank you very much, Councillor pound, that has made that quite clear, thank you, Chair, thank you, are there any more questions?
any discussion that people want to.
shall we go on to the recommendation, which is that the BHA partnership plan at Appendix A is noted and referred to Full Council on the 1st of March 2023 are we agreed?
the motion is carried.
thank you.

8 Temporary Suspension of the Housing Register

the next item on the agenda is item number 8, which is aside check and when we normally when when we we do, we do that, we look at the the various options and and afraid I rather thought that one of the things that we had actually agreed this evening was that them it would go forward with the changes that had already been agreed by Councillor Chappell out so so that's the sort of them a second option with changes that's where I thought we were getting on that one.
apologies, thank you, Councillor Marsh.
I say.
so the changes that were, I think, it was a.
Banks suggested, which I think was actually going to be.
there was the name, the name of the the Borough partnership plan.
is that it is the suggestion was that it would be called the the temperature was Borough Council Plan.
is that correct?
I think that's so would.
with that, so I do he agreed that it should go forward with that name change, as recommended by.
sorry, just to perhaps help out a little bit Chair, is that my reading of the documents that we've been provided tonight is there, there is only one recommendation.
and that is, as you read out, no, no normally in a cab we'd be presented with the 3 options 1 2 and 3, the light traffic light system, as he does years, was referred the other night, but in in the paperwork we're dealing with tonight there is only one recommendation that I can read and I get everyone's point that we want to stress those points that have been made, however there have been made in other committees and there is one recommendation of the paper on, but I'll be led by the clock if I'm wrong,
sorry, Councillor Chapman.
if I may come back on that one, so my understanding is this cannot Advisory Board would, like me and Cabinet, go back and review the points that we've May the been made about the name of the plan, obviously we need to discuss their staffing what Councillor marches proposing was option 2 for us to accept it to go forward with Cabinet going back and having consideration which is scheduled before the agendas published.
full Council,
looking at Page 3 of the agenda.
yes, are they?
the Cabinet Advisory Board are supportive of the recommendation.
with the changes with the points that were made this evening, so be.
I suppose if there's there's no change as such as just to that, they've already agreed to review the points that were made.
to do not get to consider option 3 as well.
you tell you, can you can I mean if, if there's a disagreement in the, if it's not a unanimous vote in the Chair can take a vote?
it is Chair, because there were there were other points made as well, it wasn't just one point, I think, and I think we should just be Chair, which are looking just one behind him.
that was a split, there is any one recommendation here, but I guess that that the choice is whether we take that recommendation or whether we accept the recommendation to Cabinet, subject to a number of changes or points being taken on board, one is to name,
of of the
and and and the other items that have been brought up.
so I guess we're going for in this case option 2, which is essentially take this forward with that name change and a number of other points taken forward so miserable, it does highlight what what the actual points are before, so we can be clear and if otherwise will take it will have to take a vote.
care, I think Councillor chaplain was just showing me, he's got a list, maybe he could read mad.
please, yeah, I find myself having been to for meetings of got my feedback from Monday night on this page, I've got last night and I've got tonight points tonight's points where we can only take tonight's my exit. Tonight's points, specifically that the Cabinet Advisory Board wanted us to go back and look at which was the name of the Borough partnership plan, how we could include more detail on individual
bullet points there were questions around the user pays and they were questions about carparks, EV charging points and CCTV whether that would provide value for money if those car parks were then disposed of at a later date.
would be the summary of what I think was said.
that sounds like the a comprehensive list, so with those.
item that the name change and those items being discussed in more detail, are we going, therefore, for recommendation, the second recommendation, which is essentially the recommendation, with those changes and those and and more discussion on those points?
are we agreed?
OK, we agreed, thank you.
we move on to agenda item 8.
temporary suspension of the housing register this report starts on page 40 of your supplementary pack.
Councillor LB is going to introduce the report
thank you very much Chair the report before you this evening, the temporary suspension of the housing register is a matter that's been discussed by officers with me and with the cross-party Housing Advisory Panel, whose chair is in fact a Member of this Cabinet Advisory Board.
and all of whom are supportive of the action that Stewart Clifton will be introducing in a moment.
I'm just by way of an example, last week I was on a Local government Association Housing Strategy programme, and several other authorities have recently gone through this very same exercise, interestingly, we had a good discussion about it is judged to be a positive and constructive initiative which will help both the Council and residents in the allocation of appropriate accommodation. I would therefore and urged members after debate to adopt option A at 2.00.1 options considered, which is on page 42 of your papers. Thank you, I'll hand over to Mr. Clifton
thank you, Councillor LB, and I'm not going to read the report in full, but just summarise the content of the report to much Wells is a member of the Home choice partnership, a county wide partnership of local authorities and housing associations to provide a care home, choice choice based letting system and expanded housing options IT system this is managed by Partnership Manager which is hosted by David District Council.
in July 2022, following a re-tender exercise for the IT system, Dover council's cabinet agreed to ward the system to assume to replace existing like hate this system of Wicks a contract ends in July 2023.
in order for the housing register and has an option to systems to be moved from the existing locator system to the new, whom system ahead of July 2023.
it is necessary to temporarily suspend the housing register for a period of one month from June to July this year, it is also our intention to go live with the new allocation scheme, which was previously approved by Cabinet back in October, at the same time is implementing the new housing system.
it be recommended that approval was given to temporarily spend the housing register for the period of one month from June to July to enable the transfer of the housing system and, at the same time, to require all existing housing register applicants to reapply in order to remain on the Housing Register this is an order for applicants to be assessed against the new allocation scheme using up-to-date Ella at application information.
the intention is for customers to be informed for a variety of communications of both of the temporary suspension of the housing register and the need to reapply, with additional support being provided to the more vulnerable customers, who require additional support to reapply.
thank you, thank you.
does anybody have a go at this point should we?
despite the recording Councillor ever, it has joined the meeting.
thank you, although any questions on this item.
Councillor Funnell.
but I'm looked at this and ago, few concerns about is to be honest.
in rustle, there's quite a few people who are.
in cancelled.
Town Councillor Tom country
housing that a lot of them have.
limited main, so dental health.
access to the internet that you need to go to someone on the library to the age do things, and so I think that the fact that we're talking about I can reapply and only given a three month period and now does say this.
if they don't, we are probably in the three months they have to have by both good reason for not.
but I think that might compete with reapply.
is actually against.
human rights, and they could find at the moment gone from nought to two or three bedroom property, first of all, the six you want.
so few people on the list for say for years.
and you can see the lot into the tunnel, possibly moving to bigger property, and then Sunday because you don't get any notification for whatever reason.
no excite, you have to go a long way to read your e-mail to whatever.
you, then, don't we apply it, you lose it for years she had already been on the list that I don't think is fair, so agree the is good to get a better system, but I think we should really look at a wide we can do this without my can only apply thank you.
Mitcd questioning De, do you have a response, as I guess it's the well the peep people who would find it difficult to reply via the internet what how how how to house a managed?
thank you, yes, they of the very good point never regarding vulnerable customers reapplying, just as why of information of the 800 and, just like a 7, just 70 applicants on the housing register, 73 laid applicants had Assistant with applying to join the Housing Register in with their application intended being completed by another person that's representative of a bike per cent of all applicants, of which 35 applicant had assistance from family members, 35 were from other professionals, one for you were listed as ever, so our expectation is that there will be a small majority minority of people who need some assistance but based on the existing applications there will be support available from family members and professionals.
where additional support is is required will be put in place processes to support, we've do use applicants to reapply the free month window that you refer to is to ensure that applicants.
do not lose their existing party, so in order for that window for applicants to reapply, but also with the consideration of any exceptional circumstances, why if applicant was to apply in that particular date, Duffy to consider that, in order to look at retaining their original priority, doubt, the communication that will be provided will be a in a variety of forms, so all applicants have to look into the can Home choice, account to place bids on properties that messaging on their accounts and on the website to ensure that applicants are made aware, as well as communications directly to customers via via e-mails and on our website. So we are not expecting it to be, or any applicants will be disadvantaged through this particular process.
okay, all those methods of lets people know who unknown applications are you actually gonna be voice now, 21, to let them know that this is happening as well by?
no post.
the method of communication needs via e-mail, as for applicants on the housing register, they must access the internet in order to place bids on properties.
we can set any consider other methods of communication if required, and if there's concerns that applicants may not receive an e-mail will be able to access a
can I go to question from Councillor Ellis?
furniture now of the council are currently going through his process, ready or any Council ahead of us on this, first of all, and the second question is obviously many people who have been on the housing register for many, many years have we noted that he would option in other areas or number of people in health and is due to actually doing this view and the application process?
so, to my knowledge and David council, has Cabinet had given approval for the temporary suspension of the housing register.
each District different different practices, intensive the I seeking approval for this, not all districts are implementing the new allocation scheme at the same time.
to my knowledge, Tonbridge and Malling, or looking at the same, but as far as I'm aware, that is the only other authority and they are just a little bit behind asked in this particular process.
the phenomenon, so do we expect the housing list to reduce as a result of this exercise them and will be on a waiting list.
there is a possibility that they will be reduction, as we know that some applicants will apply and then not progressive application, once they have been accepted onto the Housing Register because of changing circumstances, so there may be a small reduction in the number of applicants if applicants have chosen not to to reapply.
I say as part of the process, if we want to ensure that any vulnerable applicants are a supported.
and we have of the those measures that I've mentioned in place.
question from Councillor Nevin,
thank you,
and in terms of priorities for applicants and sometimes the length of time that they've been on, the housing register ease of a factor in their priorities.
if they were to reapply do, is there a length of time on the register going to be returned back to 0 so, as they have been waiting eight years, is it now going to go back to the very beginning, so if the applicants re-apply, we've been the three-month period, they were time it was important he liked it would only be for applicants who didn't apply in that particular time. Would we look to with a looser priority? However,
if there are exceptional circumstances as to why they didn't apply at that time, then obviously we'd consider those on an individual basis.
thank you at Bobak being made clear to applicants.
yes, within the communication, will be clear, returned to the the timelines in for applicants to reapply to retain their priority.
I've got a quiz question from Councillor Hill.
yeah, I just I think we did go through this at the Housing Advisory Panel annum agreed, but if if someone didn't apply within three months.
what's the mechanism for for contacting them, would it be us, or will it be Town and Country Moat or whether he would say Halo you haven't done this and you're on the list, but you gonna lose your your waiting time?
so as part of the communication to existing customers, we will send reminders Frew that freedom of window if an applicant was knocked to reapply within that period of time, and then subsequently we applied afterwards, and they would need to demonstrate a reason for why they weren't able to reply in that time so we wouldn't look to continue to chase or follow up with applicants once that particular windows is closed.
and so, when they go on to the bidding process, a message would come up and tell them to reapply, while would they get something like that?
yes to that, one of the the methods of communicating the message to customers so that, when they look into their can come, choice account, they will receive the messages regarding the suspension of the housing register and the requirement to reapply.
thank you, Councillor White, thank you, and I've got Country Park question really, and the first one is, I wondered why you couldn't just carry the data over, is that I guess a system problem that we can't just look to transfer on to other and then you also do talk about using this as a way to cleanse data and I just wondered how big a problem that was and how much data actually does need cleansing on the current register.
so in terms of reassess and applicants against the new allocation scheme, where we would be relying on the original application, which could be a number of years, old applicants are asked to carry out a review every 12 months, but that doesn't always update all the necessary information, so part of the reason is to ensure that we are able to assess the applications against the new allocation scheme we've correct up-to-date data rather than using the old data of data retention is
if I remember quickly six years, so there is a lot of old data that is held that isn't relevant to the existing application where applicants have previously applied and those applications being closed, so as a kind of data cleansing, rather than transferring across all that data on to a new system where they are aware that data is for for rolled applications that that no longer active.
it would it would enabler or claims in onto the new system with that data held separately for the retention period.
a, I suppose I'm just trying to get to the bottom of the fact that it's it's not that we can actually it's actually just too difficult to it just feels quite and from just worried that we're asking people to re-apply when actually there is an easy fix behind the scenes but that's not this week saying is that's not the case.
so the existing data could all be transferred across, but we still would have to assess, though, that applications against the new allocation scheme, which would mean using historic data and the the original application forms which will be more difficult.
with some of the changes made within the new allocation scheme, we may not necessarily hold all the information required so that it would require more request for information from customers where is where we've asking applicants to reapply with an application form that captures all the information we need to assess under the the new scheme will make it.
easy for officers.
Councillor March, thank you, so if, if somebody is on is on the list and the leery apply, they put in the new data and
they have a change of circumstances, which means that they could potentially be a higher priority, would they then, in fact be taken, would that be taken as almost like a new application, would they be put up the list to have a shorter waiting time if necessary?
even though they'd got a.
it at a time frame that they've been given a time frame, could that be changed.
some of the existing party they could it be made any earlier so they would retain their existing party, but of the one of the the changes that was made with the new allocation scheme was the different factors for applicants to plate be placed into a different band, so an applicant and existing applicant who we applied may potentially go into a different band that will give them a.
quicker prospect of being successful with with and allocation.
could I also come back about the new allocation scheme and I did have a word with Stuart earlier, but.
I I would quite like it to be
noted that in fact, one of the questions that I had asked about this new scheme was that there isn't a link in the report to it.
I think it's quite important that we do have a link to it.
but Stuart actually explained that well, maybe maybe he could explain now that would be really helpful than it's actually on on record, if I, if I could ask that thank you.
so there isn't a link within this particular report, as this report was focusing on the says temporary suspension of the housing register and the recommendation to reinforce reference to reapply.
the proposal, any tension needs for the new allocation scheme that was approved by by by cabinet to go out for consultation, that consultation was completed, loss earlier on this month, and there were just some minor changes made, we've been the delegation given by by cabinet.
with the change to the news to the new system and Alec act as being reassessed, the intention is for that new allocation scheme to go live at the same time as we transfer to the new housing system, well that's the reason why it hasn't been made public warning to within this particular report as it's not a currently it is an approved scheme but hasn't got long yet.
chair, I think that the point was that it it will go when this comes out, the report comes out, it will be, there will be a link to return and that the whole thing will make a bit more sense, thank you.
so, yes, this Grexit were soon as we go live with a new allocation scheme that will be made available and it will be updated on or website.
thank yous already more questions.
do we want to have a discussion, I can discussion about this and I've picked up a couple of points, well, one is that there is a concern over people who struggle with using a computer and the internet in reply, and I think that's something that perhaps should be considered in more detail.
and perhaps should be added as a.
in the recommendations.
in terms of the new allocation scheme, I'm not sure if that fully relevant, well, actually it's.
Minister says mentioned, it's mentioned in the recommendations to go forward to Cabinet, but should shudder a mention of that is be added in the report somewhere or link to it.
it's probably something that we could have in their so that it's it's available to everybody.
as to whether there are any more points that people would like to add.
Councillor final, steadfast.
abroad can do so that I think we should consider option B which some piled on page 42, which is to temporarily suspend the Health Minister but not required the existing applicants to apply.
so I see everyone would go across.
because I think that's actually better customer service to the westerns.
thank you.
I'm just heading to have a look myself.
I say the recommendation, my understanding is the recommendation is that.
as I think has option bees this, I think these was the options that were looked at, and the recommendation is that we should.
get people to reapply which great this whole the data cleanse and ensure that people who no longer want to be on the Housing Register or housing list or on it, and that and the data gets updated, that's my understanding.
is that correct?
yes, that is correct, if I may, to out just and mentioned it, if we wasn't to ask applicants to reapply once we go live with the new allocation scheme, we will in essence need to act process, and we register of seven reassess every application.
almost within the same day, which would it be possible because it always will be putting some applicants or disadvantage where some will be still assessed under the old allocation scheme, and some will have been assessed under the new allocation scheme.
so that's perhaps could have made it clear in the report, but the will need to work for all those applicants on the existing register to assess them against the new scheme, and obviously there will be a time.
that we'll take some some time and obviously, as part of the proposal, to do that while the application, while the housing Richards suspended it would mean that there will be no applicants put to a disadvantage because they were the month in order to to do that.
sorry, Councillor, ever it.
I guess who Councillor fun was proposed that can be coming back to Cabinet were to add my own comments, I would say that I'm personally very excited about this the proposals of this report, I think times and again my colleagues Castlehill and Councillor LB of highlighted the housing crisis in this borough and I think this is clearly going to bring about some.
efficiencies to enable our housing team to work through the housing need in our borough, I think I understand the concerns raised about people having to reapply to the register, but I support reassured by the explanation and that they will be duly contacted and there will be an allowance for those who fall outside of that three-month period, so I fully back the preferred options report. Thank you.
thank you, Councillor Palmer.
so customers will be informed of the states are required to take.
but other than the Amelia, and if you don't walk into the Amelia and you don't have access to a computer or whatever you're really not going to hear about it, I and I too am not very happy with the idea of existing napkins secondary apply, I think that some fair is stressful enough for people anyway.
who need a home and some of them very desperate for on So then have to reapply, but, as I said, I'm really worried that it's all very well to say chasm been formed, but you gonna miss out some people, and that's gonna be unfair to them.
I saw Councillor Ellis.
Becky or to leave it to my face.
setted streets can we be assured, during this period of time, that every person on this register, it's gonna, be contacted to be either online.
by telephone or face-to-face, particularly the got say or disabilities at an early to read resign or to bake actually have a fair crack of the whip of reapplying properly
and if for any reason there's a
first on that register who is not contactable during this period of time, would they be? How would they be properly reconsidered to ensure they're not lost their item, local people may be missed out, is there's only a certain number staff able to do this, this won't have after that assurance, before we have rates with the vows.
so, in intended that communications are, we can ensure that we will write to applicants, as well as e-mail, as well as a messaging within their Kent home twice account, which is the account, the applicants who need to access to place bids on properties, so we will had that as the means as well as the messaging on the website and,
can look at options for Mesfin within the media as well, the free month window can be extended if that would.
help put the minds of Members at it easier regarding applicant, not losing their their party, 8, so we could extend that to to, for them says that it's more favourable.
so just follow up on that one as well, so if somebody does have any difficulties, reading and writing.
would you be able to actually complete this occasion yourselves in order to actually help them dot loser basement list?
yes, as we as applicants currently do, we always advise to seek support if they need that if applicants haven't got any person to support them, then the intention is to operate out of the Amelia.
support for customers.
the finer detail hasn't been.
decided wiper we operate.
an open day where customers can come in receive support with completing their applications of the it's important applicants are there to provide the information, but within the officers would be happy to support with those applications being made.
Councillor much, thank you, thank you for your explanation at them, I am quite concerned about vulnerable people slipping through the net, and I wonder if we could have a sort of default position that obviously those people who who can and and do reapply great but for those that haven't by a couple of weeks before the the Qatif period the three months whatever teams could they be the ones in fact that would be contacted again or by another method and not just to assume?
that they don't want to be on it, because I think that that is where we're going to actually lose people, it may not be that many people, but I do feel that possibly the default should be that we we then contact them rather than expecting that they just don't want to continue, thank you.
yes, that would be be possible yeah.
Councillor White.
I just wondered if you knew how often most applicants access, a system I mean is, I suppose it is at every to they do quite often within a three-month windows and has quite a lot of times that we could potentially talk to them during that during that time period.
property, the re-advertise daily, so applicants are regularly actors in the system on a on a daily basis to check for properties that have been been advertised.
thank you, so I the
was there any more questions at well, actually really we meant to be in discussion, but that's that's fine. I think that the the tea, two items that I was listening or concern over people who would struggle to you to to to reapply I think is is is an important one and that is an important way of filling up and ensuring that they've been tracked down in some way or they are no longer living in the borough and daunting they're going to be on the list. I think that something that probably needs to be is one of the points
any other item was ensuring that the new allocation scheme is linked into the report in some way, some way was that was there, I think that those were the main two items on sale.
o n, and the consideration of extending the three-month period, which probably linked in with with how?
you can communicate with people who are currently on the list and clarifying whether they are still on going to be on the list, they no longer interested being on the list or they can no longer be found.
so probably links in with item 1 1 thing at me, if I may, I think it is really important what Stewart said about.
the fact that if we didn't do it this way, that everybody would have to be on the same day, otherwise there would be an unfair advantage to salmon, may I suggest that we could possibly put a sentence in about that because it clarifies why it can't be done.
in a different way, thank you.
yes, I think also, but I had let item in the recommendation, but I think we're.
on those recommendations and that both the PLO's items noted.
suggests we're going for item 2, which is a, I think people would is cabinet of PRU cabinet.
the recommendation
we are looking at.
it is the wrong.
so again we're going.
this item 2, is that the recommendations we carry the recommendation to Cabinet with the items that we've noted it, does everybody agree with that?
that item is any guide for option, A that what we say.
to not one thing, so the recommendations in the report, if your members are inclined, it's the recommendations to Cabinet would be supported, subject to the changes discussed.
Erica not always was to do two things, one, I'll just go to all Members' attention to the Equalities impact comment on the cross cutting, so that picks up a lot of the concerns that you brace so that that work has been done already and I was just going to clarify the issue about options and,
you're looking at the options in the report, I think, because you are referring to letters and actually the advisory panel Board has got its options are on page 3 and it's 1 2 3 is whether you support the recommendation in the report rather than the options in the reports. So you're I think, supporting the recommendations in the report with number 2 saying you support it subject to the day-to-day of various things. So there's this has got letters as options. I've tweaked the you were confusing to. The next report is numbers 1 2 3
just to confuse people.
thank you for that clarification on.

9 Household Recycling and Waste Collection Service

I think we can now move on to Item 9, the household and recycling waste collection service.
this report starts on page 2 of the supplementary pack.
the presenting officer to introduce the report introduced, the report is Gary Stephenson, Head of Housing, Health and Environment, I'll hand over to you.
I thank you, Mr. Chairman, good evening members,
I too am going to read the report in in total, but I've just pick out the the headlines and intake questions and the port for older is with us now as well, so this report is about the the current contract for the household Waste recycling and Street Cleansing contract Estate, a joint contract with our partner Authority at Tonbridge and Malling it's an eight year contract that we entered into in 2019.
the report setting two elements, the report in terms of decisions that we are seeking from from cabinet. The first element is about the current EU arrangements can continuation of additional payments that are being made to Urbaser to reflect some exceptional circumstances in the HTV market, and the second section of the report looks at proposal from ambassador to carry out a wry rounding off the existing collection rounds for the food, recycling and waste collections and also then to combine that with every fleeting of the vehicles that they operate and changing the configuration of those vehicles to take account of changes that we've seen in collection rates. Currently, the developments that we've seen in the developments we know are coming in the next years in terms of properties, but also the changes that are definitely coming and likely to come forward in terms of legislation about the way we make collections
report then contained a proposal for a service, at least those vehicles for a period of time, and they are suggesting that they least those for an eight year term which takes us beyond the end of the contract with a Basir, so there is a requirement if we accept this proposal for the council to take responsibility, although the service provider for the service that next service provider from 2027 to take on responsibility for the the lies of those those vehicles and the maintenance of them for the remaining term, which in round numbers, is going to be about for about four years and that'll be contractually required if we go out to tender and also if we decide later in 2020 5 6 that we want to bring the service in house.
no vehicles would be available for the council to use in house in in the future,
the report makes it clear that these changes are permitted under the procurement regulations and we've taken to external and internal legal advice about the applicability of the procurement regulations, and we believe that there are low risks of of any challenges occurring to the decision, as it were seeking their however,
we will be issuing what's called evict notice, a voluntary notice to advise the marketplace, that these changes are going to be agreed, and that gives us the market place a period of time to make challenges against that, and the proposed was the need account. Certainly our recommendation is that we do not intend to any agreements until that challenge period has been completed so that we you know completely risk-free in terms of any challenges.
and that kind of makes the point that the major moving are also considering a similar report, it's going to their Cabinet on the 14th of February, so there will be considering at their and the both councils as part of the full Council process for setting budgets or make decisions about the funding is required next year for the least elevation payments to as set out in the report so once all of the
decision making processes had been through which takes us to, I think it's the first of marches, the Full Council for Tunbridge Wells, which is the latter of the two meetings on the 2nd of March, will be issuing the notice subject to, although decisions being made to agree the proposals that are in front of us and then they'll be enacted, as the say wants to meet notice, that is expired after 30 calendar days.
the report sets out the implications on the vehicle was in terms of our climate commitments, is a recognised the previously we had assumed that our vehicles and 2027, as part of our carbon descent plan that will be looking to change to electric collection vehicles at that point to reduce our carbon emissions so this report, if accepted, means that those vehicles will be diesel vehicles to be replaced as part of this new lease arrangements.
from 2027, so therefore we'd need to look at re-profiling our carbon reduction.
dear descent prior to then and their options open to us, as the report sets out, is possible to use something called the HBO fuel, which is low carbon emissions, something that we could introduce at that particular stage or we could look at offsetting we wish to offset our carbon emissions at that stage or the Council could decide to tweak its commitment to 2031 when these vehicles that would be at least would
there needs to be replaced with alternative vehicles and that could be beneficial to ask to have that because at the moment our colleagues in Mid Kent clusters, Zoe Ashburton swollen and and makes no recently re procured their contract very recently been announced and they looked at the opportunities for Ince having electric vehicles collection vehicles and from that moment that Mark is not quite right certainly for.
areas, the revenue and and and sub sub supper or the electric vehicles to stone stack up currently, and therefore we may find that when we have to make that decision in 2027, actually, electric market vehicle market still not quite mature enough in terms of collection vehicles and were being a similar position that would either be having to expand a significant amount of money to invest in electric vehicles or they just might not be the right type of a vehicle available at that time. So he is giving us time to see how the market changes over the coming years and make any necessary adjustments to the electricity supply at the depot and those sorts of practical things. So there are some benefits from having the the longer lease
going beyond the end of the existing contract with Urbaser.
I think that's it was him, I appreciate this, the recommendations are quite long and and and and wordy again, following advice, deliberately so because there are a number of agreements that need to be entered into.
to make sure that these arrangements are contractually sounds as agreements with herself and Tonbridge and Malling Borough Council, a better and the parties them themselves, and the the the recommendation 1, in terms of the extending the payments that are currently being made,
needs to be properly documented as well, so there's a lot of text there happy to take questions on on those and on the report.
thank you very much for that, are there any questions, Councillor much?
thank you,
Gary referred explanation were originally a when we started with Urbaser, I think they were quite
surprised by the number of a different sized vehicles that would be needed, and I think they found that more of the smaller variety were needed for some of the rural areas will up, can you be assured that with the new vehicle, the new fleet, they're talking about that they will actually have enough of the smaller vehicles or or different sizes to accommodate all need, thank you.
yes, Councillor ITA correctly other, now a vehicle is is is actually a particularly Tunbridge Wells issue, I think wasn't or Tunbridge issue in terms of our narrow access in and around amateurs town but the rural areas to a battle fully aware of that as part of the process, the the re rounding process of looking at how
collection rounds are made up. We are looking at that in great detail to make sure that those around a balance properly, but also that the yet the right vehicle is accessing the right area and certainly the indicative fleetness that we have seen as part of the early part of the proposals as as good or a range of vehicle. So the the narrow and meet them be mid mid-size and and something called a superhero as well. We got some with only narrow spots that have to be done so yeah, that's that's in the list. We haven't agreed the final list. That's again part of the process. There will be going through over the next month or so as to make sure that the rounds up say do work and got the white vehicles allocated
thank you.
Councillor Palmer.
as we know, this companies never exactly covered themselves in glory how they.
so, I have to say, alarm bells start to ring, when you talk about RIRA doing the round and changing the routes because, as has happened in the past,
you get an different group of guys going out and they don't go down that path that they don't go down that lane, and then we have complaints and everybody's cross, which quite rightly they are because they've been missed out,
so how are you going to ensure this doesn't happen again?
thank you, Councillor, yes, very much alive to those properties that have got slightly different accesses or not, and access or not inexact on the main road and how Cruise have learnt that you're you're right, they've learned the rounds now and we're about to split them up again, although those properties that we've had access issues with our flagged in our database.
and when we recommend that the garden waste rounds that changed earlier in the year, we pulled out the list of of properties that had issues back in 2019 2020 where those might have been sold and have been sold, but we brought them back out of the database to make sure that the new staff and the new supervisors are fully aware of particular addresses that had issues for the first few months have been sold and I don't want them to reappear because of the nature of where they are, so we working very hard on that and saying we've got experienced with a garden waste re rounding which,
you know when in November and that has gone well, that has resulted in different round, so I didn't crews covering different areas, however, they've learnt those areas quickly and with the help of the the hotspot notifications on the system it's when we've done a lot of trying also observed a lot of training with their staff to make sure they are aware of that, so will that's very high on our list of of things to make sure that they get right?
Leisure also, where I do have invested in in hawkers, who has an assisted collection that has had an awful lot of trouble, including to where the guys have said, Well, can you bring your bidding to the top of the top of the gate well know she has assisted collection for a reason?
want to make sure that that residents near you very well aware of doesn't have issues again.
that would be unless I
they've got the address somewhere in the back of my mind, certainly I'm aware of it.
that's a good example, where you know there has been an issue, it's been solved, but what I don't want to do is for so Nuku that, inter on land, what needs to it was was been sold previously, so would take there is or there will be a list of so previously previous hotspots that are now apparently OK, but let's go back and make sure that if if they for new cruise allocated to them, that nuclear knows what the issue is.
thank you, thank you know, Councillor White, thank you and see I mean agreement with bed-socks, we don't want to go back quite some for several problems, but you also talk and in point 2 1 4 about that this is gonna, bring about efficiencies and service improvements. I just wondered if he could give us a little bit more detail about what those are because it I couldn't quite understand its
it sounds like it's, it's one of reconfiguring the round, I can quite understand what what the actual benefits we're gonna be.
yeah, so it's in terms of reconfiguring so as as time has gone on, but in a kind of bits of various get added to rounds, that's perhaps not the most efficient use of resources, but because that mounds got a bit of space on the vehicle they send them.
potentially out of their way to do the collection.
taking a kind of unnecessary time, but if, if you start again and and re round, you can get a, you know a shorter route round more to be more effective, but now, as time has gone on in those new properties have been built cruise about that that added on what can think of was dealing with this week at Hawkenbury whether new Bobby I'm site as it has been built so that crew has done that, but it's you know they're not they're not necessarily in the right place to then go and do the rest of the the the round so his it starts afresh so you can get those efficiencies.
are no so because the the we're gonna, separate food waste collections out, so the Durutti of people have their food waste collected on the same vehicle with the refuse or with the re cycling, there are some places where it is separate.
what a better suggesting it had been happy, actually having all FU collected by smaller, separate food waste collection vehicles, so you and I can excuse me, I'm quite quickly, and the recycling the refuse collected by dedicated vehicles for for refuse and recycling and that helps to their efficiency because they're finding that.
we know the guys are putting the food into the the the the the the vehicle can go quicker than the guys that are putting the cardboard into the papers, that's kind of slowing him down, so by separating it out as his two vehicles but actually over a course of a fortnight they can get round to more properties like that so there that they're the things in ensuring it should produce the amount of mileage than they cover so that should have some impact on our carbon emissions even with the existing with existing fuel, so there's a range of arrange things that can look can help.
Councillor Ellis.
or if it is right?
I thank you Chair.
therefore, we suddenly questions by-catch, talk about direction, web-based Urban villages to the fleet and movements we halfway through the current fleets, life expectancy from Boyd, one standard, so therefore we can 2027 as the new perspective here you mentioned the discount in electric vehicles but a lock and chain technology-wise in a four year period in his car market.
when Wood Bass and need putting the orders for the new fleet and will be any change of something new came along, which makes makes more usable protective of playing bass like Tunbridge Wells, where at some of the electric vehicles be better used, can they can we make any changes that's arrangement.
so this proposal wisdom this new fleet would be ordered as soon as the Councils of finished their decision making process of Aceh again to place their order in a in the next month or so two months for the vehicles, so there's no change once we've done that there are no changes then and William fixed for for the eight years on on the lease.
if you are talking, hypothetically, about what happens for the next contract and 2027, when would you need to place the you know if you if you are replacing?
a new vehicles for that that contract, when you would you be placing your order, there is a bit of a depends about that because so I'm making colleagues are found that the market for vehicle was is quite fluid at the moment quite difficult to nail down prices so there you know that the timing of their ordering,
ticked No, normally you'd let the contract the contractor would.
the winning contractor would have have slots ready in the production process and they would have their new vehicle would, in theory, somewhere at the start of the contract or action, has been a little bit further on to allow other vehicles to be to be mobilise, so you would be looking if invite pathetically you'd be looking at ordering vehicles in 2026 or 27 for the new service.
but with this proposal you, you know, you, you were moving that decision Point and putting it off until 2030 slash 31 to your moving moving forward, so yesterday the markets can change.
so it you know, we are getting close to that deadline, This gives us that certainty, though, that come 2031. We, we know that we'll have a fleet of vehicles that can continue to operate the service for at least a few more years whilst we then make another decision on the next round of vehicles and you might find things have changed, so by the time he gets when 29 30 we could be added and it could be, it could be Electric
could be ashamed.
Councillor Mark, thank you Chair.
I notice that tiny got this voluntary transparency notice and that Tim we're going to hopefully published, do you anticipate other companies actually challenging, and that's why we do this is it is it something they would challenge, asked how they would change or Vassar.
thank you.
thank you. So it would be challenges Oscars our our decision about contractors possibility that it there are, so there is a possibility of, I think the in advice were having is the risk is is low, certainly other that if you look at other Council contracts around waste, whether that be about disposable collection, other councils have made changes to their contractual arrangements and use the beak process and haven't been challenged, and I think a number of different companies of benefited from that the process. So there were we doing it to make sure that we do. We are certain that there is no challenge before we proceed.
but we
the it's low risk in terms of the likelihood.
could I can let check?
so when you speak to any of the other logic, companies beforehand, or is that not a good idea?
so we won't be reaching out to any other companies, so the big notice is published in the procurement journals, which they all sign up to the get an alert when anything is published of of of the that nature so we went be proactively going to them but they will be aware of it through that process just out of interest that it would be published in the EU journal as well as the UK journal because this contract was let for Brexit day so both.
genitals apply.
Councillor White.
thank you, and I just actually had one more question, which was actually about the one off payment at the which was, I think, his in right at the beginning of this proposal.
because of obviously, and I understand that's because the markets change and they've had to increase wages and all that sort of thing, but are we confident that that is going to be that we're not setting a precedent with that because I'm guessing that they're not going to drop wages going forward so they're gonna have to there's going to have to be the allowance for paying drivers more beyond the
beyond March 23,
so that's yeah, paragraph 1.3 so the additional payments until the end of this year, so a basso originally had asked for those payments to continue for the life of the contract to to make up the difference from the increase in the drivers' pay that gone from 13 pounds an hour to 18 pounds now payments to quite significant change.
has worked, because previously they were relying on quite a significant proportion of agency drivers, and now, as of this morning, the the phrase was the high 90% of staff are actually employed and regular. We're not having the turn off of staff, so it's been successful, so they've asked me for the whole period of the contract. However, both councils have considered that in in detail and can recognise that this year there have been some exceptional circumstances that make a payment in acceptable to be made
however, next year indexation on this contract is 16.3%, so it's a significant increase because it's based on inflation RPI and the d've index from October, that's that's just gone.
so they will be getting a significant uplift contractually, that's a contractual uplifts us over 600,000 pounds to our view is that that sufficient to be able to cover the additional costs for wages, but they currently have, and I suspect, will have in the future because I'm not sure the HTV market now has has slightly come back into alignment but you know they will need to cover that cost from,
the contractual inflation is coming forward and saying, OK, no LP, I was and and the the the, it's was at 16%, that's sufficient, we believe to cover the costs going forward because that's been built into the contract that the the contracts I'm increases by that and the no is indexed e chairs I
Councillor Ellis, as you just follow up on that and we talked about a driver training school through a vastly really, I had a bit of experience side, better project 2015 16 and Dr re-learning suggests understand the market itself at that time, the drawing shorten UK as about 60,000 now its way 100,000 shortage.
how hard has ambassador done to achieve crew internally in order to train up drivers nor to ensure that avoid net, also, what's terms of golden handcuff to there have, on a driver, training, sought a solid investment?
things are not 100% sure, Councillor Ellis, so I know that they we're putting some staff through that process of training so they identified it's not currently don't drive for them and put them through, but I don't know the number can conceive for you and feed that feed that back certainly would be urging them to continue doing that that process of because, although they have got high level how levels of employment at the moment they need to have that pipeline going forwards and I don't know what the if there I don't think they put any company and checks. On again, I can confirm that
thank you has already more questions.
do you want to go into discussion about this, I haven't really had any.
adjustments or changes to the recommendations.
sorry, Councillor, every do you want us, thank you Chair, just to express my thanks for the
hard work that's gone into this report by Gary in the team I've seen at first-hand, and it really is impressive the amount of knowledge that team has and hard work they put into this report, I think.
to add to the electric vehicle points that Councillor Ellis raised, I think, is hard to point any market that stable at the moment, this in this extremely difficult time the case facing I do think that we start effects flexibility going forward in 27 games. Gary's mentioned to to review the fleet and whether electric vehicles are an option. At that point I I'm I'm quite excited about the opportunity this this fleet reflating will bring forward, which is the the potential switch to HBO fuels
and is something that the new modelling, as part of our 2030 commitment to take account of and something that perhaps we can review in terms of a cost, that's more viable at this time that any switch to electric vehicles, I guess one of the other issues with electric vehicles is also,
where they are being used, you'll notice, generally speaking, as it's an urban location, be a London borough, it seems that this time apply, and that's the geography of a semi rural borough, such as ourselves doesn't doesn't scale up necessarily, so it's it's is a developing situation for HTV collection vehicles to be electric, but I think we should all be excited about.
the potential to use new fuels, which was consignor, frequently reduced the emissions of the fleet
thank you, I think you've picked up on a number of points, which are things that probably be come up in the future rather than a for this decision tonight.
so I
I didn't see any adjustments to the recommendations, or I haven't lesser anybody thinks there are, I'm sorry I, it looks like we are waiting on the recommendations to Cabinet, a supported by the board, do do I agree with that.
the motion is carried on this item, thank you.

10 Urgent Business

plus my page.
so it now on Item number 9, which is urgent business.
I can confirm there is no such business this evening,

11 Date of the Next Meeting

and the item 10 is the date of the next meeting, the next meeting is scheduled to take place on Wednesday, the 8th of March 2023, this meeting is now closed, thank you for listening and for your attendance.