Joint Transportation Board - Monday 3 July 2023, 6:00pm - Feedback Tab - Tunbridge Wells Borough Council Webcasting
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let me know when.
when we started Areas'.
we are alive
OK and it's lovely thank you very much, Louise good evening everyone, I'm Sarah Hamilton, I'm the Chairman for of this, the GTB for this year.
I'm coming on to that tonight, though, to say that I unfortunately would have to leave the meeting early because of an unforeseen circumstances and having discussed the issue with pilots and who is the vice chairman, he has kindly agreed to chair the meeting. I will stay around and drop off when I need to, but I'd like to thank Peter for doing that. We worked it out that it would be better and more
Tidy and and more consistent. If, if I'm a suggest, start the meeting of and
take it from, there, so Peter thank you very much and over to you
so everyone on Councillor Peter Stone, Vice Chairman of the Joint Transformation Board,
chairing tonight's.
so before we start the meeting, a few procedural issues to go through, I'll be very grateful for your attention, so pass over to the Clark Lewis column.
thank you and good evening everybody, this meeting is being held remotely Vizeum and webcast live online recording will also be available for payback on the council's website afterwards,
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passengers who have registered to speak at the meeting have just been admitted to the meeting in advance to avoid technical issues where possible,
I ask that they stay muted and silent until their item comes up, whereby they will be advised or invited to speak by the Chairman.
there will be short pauses at the beginning of these items to ensure that all relevant policies are on the cool.
and members must remain mute during this time and should not speak until the meeting me resumes.
after any statements have been made, the speakers may leave the meeting and follow the rest of the proceedings proceedings via the live webcast, thank you.
please make that clear to everyone.
so.
benefit recording, we're going to take a roll call, sorry Lewis, who call out your name if you're present, please introduce us so
Councillor Liston is present.
Councillor Munday,
Councillor Roberts,
at present,
Councillor O'Connor present
Councillor Lewis
present
Councillor barrington, King
present
Councillor Holden.
councillor McInroy.
as
Councillor Oakford
present
Councillor very.
Councillor Hamilton.
present and I'm the county member for Tunbridge Wells rule
posh Councillor McConnachie, present.
and then officers, Julian Kaye
present Hillary Smith.
isn't John Strachan?
present and David Conlin present.
I think that's everyone.
Louisa M Nick Baldwin is trying to get online as well, actually, so he may, hopefully he may join shortly,
okay, absolutely, thank you.
and we had apologies from Councillor Atkinson, I correct yes,
apologies from Castle actions and just for the benefit of the recording Councillors, Holden or Bruner not present at the meeting.
thank you.
so members of the Committee,
existing members may be familiar with the process but for the benefit of a new joining members, first of all welcome.
and I'll explain a couple of things so committee members have had their agendas for ever week and have had the opportunity to ask any factual questions of the officers had a meeting
when we come to the substantive items on the agenda and those which the Speaker will be asked in turn to read a statement and I will have a maximum of, three minutes each that applies to
visiting members and members of the public and not members of GTB.
after the speakers, relevant officer who set up the report is present. it will then move into member discussion. at the end of the debate, I will try to summarise the Committee's view and members should ensure that any proposals or actions are correctly captured.
the first item on the agenda is apologies for absence,
yeah apologies received from Councillor Atkin.
thanks Lewis. the second item is declarations of interest, so Members.
someone have a declaration of interest relating to any of the items on the agenda tonight.
no.
the
third item on the agenda is notification of persons wishing to speak.
so. Louis, we have any suspensions
yeah, loan of Blackmore's registered speak on Item 6, which stammering traffic regulation, order on high streets, and Councillor Justin Rutland, Sally Atkinson Pippa Khaled and Jim Courier registered, to speak on Item 7, update on public realm to bus gate.
thank you, Louise.
so we now move on to agenda item 4, which is to prevent minutes of the meeting,
firstly, the minutes of the meeting held on 30th January,
so does anyone have any amendments to make to these minutes?
no.
OK, then,
we will approve as minutes,
and the next agenda item is meet, Minister, the following meeting, so a 73 for our last meeting, does anyone have any amendments to make to these minutes?
in that case, then, we'll move on to the next item on the agenda, which is the permanent traffic Regulation order on the High Street Tunbridge Wells.
so.
a first registered speaker or registered speaker rather tonight is known as blackmail.
Louis, we have known her uncle.
yes, charity, belief, we tae yeah.
Lorna iView have a 3 minutes.
I am ready to cash in on staff.
this is a consultation on the high street, and this is. rip response from the transport working group for the town forum
are a recent straw poll of high street traders, suggested that the one way scheme has been successful and largely popular
observations as local residents are the the one way. Northbound flow of the high street has been an improvement, reducing traffic flow, making it easier, safer and more pleasant for pedestrians and other road users.
There is a strong view that what replaces the current temporary scheme should be a high quality of design and materials and in keeping with the conservation area and the style of the street.
the location of the current parklets on the west side of the High Street could be spread further towards the mid and southern end of the road and enabling more catering outlets to take advantage of the pavement dining
management of potless plant boxes and litter bin should be clarified.
currently, Road Tunbridge Wells Bloom supplies the plants, but watering weeding and litter removal is not allocated, ideally nearby businesses would be best placed to undertake this on a daily or weekly basis.
The pavements on the west side should be widened to enable wheelchairs and buggies easier passage on the bollards originally installed for pedestrian safety when the road was to a should be removed removed. To create more space
parking on the eastern side should be reviewed removing parking adjacent to the junctions of the side streets with High Street would improve driver visibility and vehicle turning parking directly opposite two sitting areas should be limited
as manoeuvring vehicles come too close to the public
these spaces might be reserved for deliveries,
design improvement is needed at the Vale Road junction to make turning out clearer and easier
the design of the Graffoe Road Mount Pleasant, Dale Road High Street junction should be reviewed to improve traffic flow and possibly the installation of a yellow box junction be considered at the Vale Road junction with London Road.
thank you very much, Lorna
appreciated that
comprehensive feedback,
so I will handover now to Hillary Smith, Thomas Roses. economic Development Manager, to introduce the report,
thank you very much.
thank you Lorna,
I just like to say that obviously this report was published
late on last week, so apologies about that, but about the reason for that was that the
consultation on the tyro has any actually finished day, so we were wanting to lay the report until well, not until the absolute last minute, but later on, so that so that we could give you as much information as possible and hopefully, hopefully some maybe have had a chance to read it, but just running through it quickly,
the initial scheme in the high street was introduced under the emergency active travel fund scheme funded by the Department for Transport.
as a result of the Covid pandemic, and the aim was to support social distancing and also the businesses in the high street, to provide more space for outdoor eating and drinking,
and following some feedback about the initial temporary scheme
Tunbridge Wells Borough Council working with KCC colleagues
then introduced the the parklets and planters.
street furniture, and that was funded through again government funding from the welcome back fund, which was again aimed at helping businesses to recover from the pandemic. We also had contributions from the business improvement districts and from their KCC combined members grant as well to provide that street furniture.
We wanted to remind councillors that quite a comprehensive consultation was undertaken once a scheme had been implemented. So in the autumn of 2021, and were we actually, with the help of the town for,
and the business Improvement District went down to the high street, we went into all of the businesses to talk to them about the scheme, and we also question visitors and residents that were walking down the street or visiting the shops, and also posted letters to local residents, and I included in their reports and charts there that the show at that time that there was quite a good level of support for the scheme
by both both general support for it but also for the idea that it might be made more permanent in the future.
but even anew, as you can see this, also there was, there would be even more so support for it if.
some changes were made in terms of improvements, but I'll come back to that.
so just to emphasise at the moment that the the question in hand is about just about the traffic regulation order for the one way that the one way northbound.
operation observes the traffic now, so
that that that is what the consultation was about just about the one way way routing rather than about the street furniture itself,
so the consultation opened on the night of June and, as I say any just close today at 12.00.
and that was a public consultation, so KCC put that on their website, notices were placed in the High Street
and Thomas Wells Borough Council also delivered by hand letters to residents in the area and also to businesses in the area.
so the result of that consultation is that we had a total of 57
responses, of which 25 of the responses were objections and 32 were in support.
just to summarise, first of all the objections they fell into a number of categories, the first was
people who would like to see the reversal of the direction of the one way routing, so from northbound to southbound,
the second were largely around the fact that
objectors considered that it has caused additional traffic congestion in in other parts of the town, mainly in
the Grove Hill, Road and and Vale Road area.
Some of those did some, some of the responses suggested that they
congestion was much wider than that, but
they later it was in the the area to the north of the High Street.
1 1 respondent did comment on the fact that.
it was considered that it made the scheme made crossing Vale Road more difficult, however, as officers we we recognise that that's always been an issue cross the crossing about road by the station, so
some of the objections I have said also did refer to issues which are not directly relevant to this tyros so,
that's just to be borne in mind, but that there was just a couple of those and then in terms of the support
for the scheme,
that really
covered issues, including improve the the recognition that the scheme had improved the local environment it was considered to offer greater safety for pedestrians and cyclists.
certainly there it was considered that their scheme was supporting, particularly some of the hospitality businesses in the high street better.
and that it will, as I say, that it was a more pleasant environment for pedestrians and and visitors to the to that area to to use
so that so there were the there were certainly certainly things coming out from the supporting comments, some of which I'm Lorna's mentioned,
so
the intention is to make their tiro permanence.
and but to maintain the northbound direction of the full scheme, because you know that was always intentional to try and.
reduce the amount of of three traffic that wasn't actually using the street to visit, to visit the shops and the restaurants, etc
just another thing to remind Councillors is that actually no no parking has been lost as a result as you move out of the scheme either.
so we're looking to make the scheme permanent at the moment and and although, as I said, it's not directly relevant to this terror at the moment and today's Borough Council is already working with the business improvement district to look at
ways we could.
design improvements to the street furniture in response to some of the feedback that we've had to, as I say, that work is underway but obviously dependent on
the tiro being agreed for the
while the one-way system northbound, and what I haven't said, sorry is that at the moment that the the temporary tiro expires in September, so we're obviously looking to get that disagreed before that.
so I'll probably stop there if that's all right and I'm happy to take any questions and
Nick Boldron and David Carolina here also so hopefully between us we can answer any questions you may have
either.
sorry, Members, I've too any questions for Hillary
Nick Oded.
Councillor Munday,
no questions to start, I think it's a good idea.
personally, the past, I've used it as a cut-through to say, Dad was spent on.
which is probably no parking, northbound, alleviates the issue.
so and as a culture that way anyway, I haven't noticed in negative effects,
and the guy rapper station Mr. Journalist, rape
survivor.
thank you. Councillor,
anyone else wished to speak or ask a question of the essence.
Councillor Lewis.
yeah, I just wanted to reiterate what Councillor Munday said, I mean I think it's a great idea and and I think some improve the traffic flow and Stephen businesses.
a shot in the arm as.
ammo said I mean,
do they need that in the high street and people have got used to it now and I think when they were making a nice environment.
for people to eat out
and enjoy themselves, which
is
what one for is the raison d' etre of the high street, is not rarely
to take half the traffic away and in an improved situation.
I know you've moved traffic a move around the town, but taking it out of that one small area,
I think it's made, it is my great difference
more than his thanks.
thank you, Councillor.
cancer.
yeah
add
the comments, may do you know about the scheme, but what I'm quite interested in is what's the process and some of the things that lone or Blackwell mentioned generally, they could spend partners coolness.
just generally, how do we go about improving afterwards, you know Mr. Process to doing that.
well I and in terms of
I know, I'm not sure about prices in terms of the work that we're looking to do, as I say it is to try and improve to work with.
the business improvement district, but also obviously Kent County Council colleagues and come up with some improvements to the scheme that could you know that May might well I announced some of those issues, I guess,
but
you know in the main we're looking to.
improve the quality of the street furniture as well and make this scheme sort of fail a bit more permanent
perhaps than it does at the moment
I don't know NEQ whether you would want to comment on the
processes in terms of
traffic management, I suppose.
thank you, sir Mr. Tyson Morris, having difficulty staying put
as far as possible because you consider there are restrictions already in place on Conor's junctions, so I'm not sure what the issue would be there and the process basically is difficult
problems with helped vehicles that be tested.
force by either are so tasty, but I should about the finish. if restrictions are necessary or amendments, restrictions are necessary that that can be put through.
the application process.
Kinnock identifies my connection but no bit broken there,
yeah like Saudi areas Barca
circa, I think I think we got the gist.
Councillor Connor, there's a sort of answer your question.
but
the things that don't mention.
junction unit, because it is quite awkward, turning up, you know, you come up northbound and it's quite new turn, so I'm just wondering exactly you know how to we suggest further improve and hopefully they get action I know it's not relevant to this particular decision but it's thinking about the future.
only going to suggest if Lerner could capture the
the comments
by e-mail with officers, I think I'll be a good first step so that we can follow up on that, I mean things like planting as well,
it is within within the remit of the Bar Council,
we don't have Councillor Bruno on a cool and I believe it be her area for Highways unevenly the county councils want to suggest.
to Councillor Kono, what the process would be if we wanted to
look at the impact of the the northbound one-way system on the junction with our ride.
0Julian.
thank you Chair, yes, I mean, it's certainly be looked at, I mean I know Hillary mentioned that obviously visit the paper today is just looking at the traffic regulation order and long term there is a project of KCC and working to merge wells together about improving the parklets through their, I suspect, as part of that design, those issues will be looked at during that that consultation and and looking at the potential issues around the junction, I've not witnessed any issues myself at the junction, I don't know what the crash record is,
but all that will be picked up as part of that stage, 2, I think today's just really about the temporary traffic order and turning it into a permanent traffic order, and then there's a sort of Phase 2 to look at the improvements on the scheme long term and that'll be picked up as part of that process.
thank you clarifies,
thank you. thank you and Councillor Akhtar
thanks Peter
and support.
what Mr. Cook said obviously finances try an awfully big party this, and who would fund the money coming from, because KCC's budget would not stretch to absolutely anything at this time for the 7 billion pound I've spent last year and already saying I spend pressures in the first contradict year we're looking at Cyber Monday so anything that is budgeted.
the funds would not be made by.
if the traffic order is agree, if it's thing Highways consider site and they're willing to support it, then it may be something the champion
for disabled take forward.
thank you.
and I think we are one of the advantages of the scheme today has been involved in it, a bit
I don't want to
put them in a position, but it, but they have been very supportive and so far, so
maybe something we can look at future.
I say anything further members on this.
if not, I would suggest that we are all of the comments so far have been supportive.
and so.
are we happy to
to?
vote.
in favour of this terror being put forward to
become a permanent.
terror.
agree, agreed grade
yeah, I'm happy, I agreed.
agreed.
thank you.
OK, everyone, okay.
and thank you Hillary and loan of
originals, speak least as I do food on the
your comments to hospital are really really helpful,
so they say, can I just say we will obviously take into account names, comments and, and it's not will continue to monitor this scheme and work with KCC colleagues to improve further as we can and without this
thanks for the comments,
so maybe on the next agenda item, which is updates on a public realm to a skate, so we have for registered speakers.
first, on my list is a Sally Atkinson, so Sally the we have you.
when you see me, can you hear me
by fear salye below
and sigh I normally is teen someone not familiar with them at all again. so the KCC petition to scrap PR, too, has now reached over a thousand signatures evidencing the need to review the scheme, Pay Day cue, the Ministry of Transport recommends ongoing, regular communication with households in the area, yet neither council has actually done on this
Dunkley your comprises more than 350 residences and businesses receiving clients through the day 1 5 2 residences have active parking permits. parking close to home is essential for residents with infants and young children, the difficulty to do so is for some young families to leave this being compounded by the unnecessary and environmentally unfriendly lengthy route imposed by PR to I have two solutions which I would very much like people to discuss, if not tonight they as an agenda item for the next meeting one is white listing the vehicles of residents with parking permits, the second is, she was exiting London, Road will only be allowed to enter York, but not Dudley. at the end of fuel traffickers, traffic is directed left as is now to enter Dudley where it's one way direction will be reversed, meaning no traffic will be able to exit from Dudley on to Mount Pleasant residents will now be able to shorten a circuit to find parking and avoid crossing Bells carriageways at Mount Pleasant which currently test
this creates a similarly pervasive mangy frame and Lime Hill roads the roadway layer was already in place will not need to be adapted for this to happen. Currently there are no signs actual at the entrance or exit to Dudley in respect of pay or to say non needs. Removing no entry signs will need to be placed at his London Road and signage on your clothes remain with minimum alteration, Dudley or parking bays will be unaltered. These changes and therefore simple and incur minimal cost easily fundable from the sizeable PC and revenue stream
Dudley and York service arteries to access the town centre. The time foreign traffic counts evidence little reduction in vehicles exiting Dudley. No further extension would deny access to months and from your with the above scheme during the restricted hours. This could significantly reduce vehicle numbers on Bells. Dudley new benefiting their residents delivers a is and contractors dare to moreover, it will eliminate the excess volume of traffic currently diverted on to Munson Calverley, Charles Crescent and Church roads, we have yet to witness the full impact of this additional traffic in the busy weeks pre-Christmas, particularly on Crescent Road,
these rates should say on congested and restored traffic flow enhancing their environmental amenity, which has been directly compromised by the payout to diversion of 3 minutes CHA.
at a time when the safety of pedestrians as well, bizarrely, my last remark on all of the above rights.
thank you very much, Sally.
our next register speaker is Jim Kay.
urgent, yes, we can really see, and he and the swimmers solely on used to teams.
I say three minutes.
please go ahead when you're ready, thank you.
I've never felt the need to speak at a council meeting before, but the current course of action to bring Ms this point respect to PR, to
whichever political colour you lot, I'm so use councillors are here to consult and serve the electorate, who voted for you and not put forward your own agendas on the basis that you know best. which is certainly how I feel at present
to be clear, you have restricted approximately 100 metres of road between 9 am and 6 pm, this is a word, but that was not too busy in the first place,
I understand that the original version vision was for, and I quote from the last Council minutes an iconic public square that would compliment the Town Hall and Amelia Scott building.
this was clearly a floor plan from the stars, buses and taxis are still allowed for the iconic puppet Square. used Castres have therefore implemented an imperfect plan and failed to consult us, the electorate, who may well have added some variable input we know the plan does what, exactly
as a resident of Dudley Road we now face the ridiculous scenario that when attempting to partner a home in the users scenario that there is no way to park, we as residents therefore have to drive that Munson, Road Calverley Road because called a roundabout Crescent Road and Church Road to the loop back on to London Road, which is clearly worse for the environment as well as air pockets and the time plus adding to the traffic than the is for Mitch roads for the businesses among some road delivery vans reach a point where they have to do a three-point turn or use Newton Road which is not fair on them. for those who do not use Luton Road is clearly a safety hazard that does not appear to have been taken into account, just as Plex, the shop, that has had the recent addition of a car to its shop window display,
if anyone has taken the time to speak to the businesses on Munson Road, you'll find that they are struggling to get deliveries and for people to click and collect in the case of cooks this is say the drop in custom as customers are reluctant to drive back clubs into town.
with respect to parking, I also failed to understand what Sandy Park is a free-for-all, with people parking on tight pavements and Dudley Road. What can turn totally right on an evening or on a Sunday is like an obstacle course between cars and pins to the point where couples with young children or years of moved away we appear to be in the final nail in the coffin.
We are now in a situation of trying to make a silk purse out of a pig's ear, which is a shame as the intentions were good but ill thought through. It may well lead to unintended consequences such as less visitors to our TW. You'll be put off by the fines and subsequent loss of footfall to shops not leading to the continued decline of the city centre. This could achieve your goal, but of less traffic, at the expense of the town centres businesses.
I'm aware of one person has no intention of shopping or tw again of yet no fine and appeal to trap to summarise from a Dudley Road residents' point of view. There are no benefits appear to the whole scheme. Verges on the ridiculous but has now turned a cash cow and the Caspian King, I fully expect you to ignore my words. I would, however, urge you to consider scrapping the whole scheme, despite the money also support support the loop solution suggested by Sally Atkinson. Thank you.
thank you to him for your first time you spoke very well.
thinking.
and
we have pepper colored as well, so pepper you on the coat
I'm here to need any Peter
yes, I can hear you and see Pepper syncing
that's dry, OK, so just to introduce myself and my name is kept colours and a resident of York Road in the town centre Tunbridge Wells or read directly impacted by the enforcement puppet run stage 2.
in October 2017, as an initial JCB meeting Councillor Rankin voiced her concerns that the scheme would mean traffic would simply be displaced Councillor Ledston, whilst generally supporting the reduction of town centre traffic was concerned, the scheme would simply be moving traffic around what followed was inadequate and ineffective consultation in 2018 I spoke in the town hall representing the concerns of York Road residents. Despite all concerns that were raised at that meeting, the motion was passed
during the detailed design stage, the design of stage two key features were lost and the scheme mutated from the imagined public realm into a mere highway scheme, as a result, what should have been iconic schemes, compromise and has been widely ridiculed, the signage is complex and misleading, the routing of vehicles is not intuitive and drivers are quite rightly confused. further to a freedom of information request in the period of five weeks between the 3rd of April and the 5th and the 7th of May, a total of 12,159 PCSOs were issued, which represents an average of 350 vehicles every day of the week this netted a revenue of 857,000 pounds. Surely this is clear evidence of a system that is not working and it is no wonder that the public thinks that it is a council cash cow.
problems for York, Road residents include rat running often at speed, the resultant pollution, safety issues, parking problems caused by the three quarters of mile detour, and the no right turn along Mount Pleasant, we stand together with Dudley Road in our distress at how the day-to-day life of local residents has been impacted.
Sally has spoken to you tonight regarding the circular route proposal which York Road is likely to support, subject to consultation, our alternative proposal again subject to consultation, is we open, Dudley Road to be closed at the town end as in many areas of London with removable bollards for the emergency services during Phase 2 building works York Road was in fact closed for a few months and it worked very well
the benefits of this scheme are as follows reduce to reduce traffic in the town centre residential roads therefore cleaner, less polluted residential streets. no rat-running and therefore a safer crossing point at Munson Road, few people using the roads therefore easy for residents and a much simpler town centre traffic system for the council to enforce
let's work together to fix this, thank you.
but.
and we have cancelled Justin Rose and his.
member for Chorlton and
portfolio Holder for
town centre, economic development, I believe, or has your task to change?
economic development and needs a thank you, I'll I'll just go ahead that Seretse yeah.
so good evening, everyone at Festival a few words on behalf of Alison Barton of the Inner London Road Residents' Association, she tried to register to speak, but the Scots already filled membership from there is mainly inner London Road but includes residents from York church and Santon Dudley,
our residents are deeply unhappy about the increasing impact of the changes to the town centre and the surrounding streets, particularly those affecting our members traffic on Inner London Road York, Road and Dudley Road needs to be restricted and have speed control. in London, Road should not continue to be a filter lane for a 26 traffic wanting to skip the lights or jump ahead, it needs to be included within town centre traffic calming.
both are 26 and 86 torch cross, the Inner London Road are over congested with cars, buses and HDTVs, both roads are hugely polluted, the people worst affected those living being educated and working in the buildings, fronting the 8 26 and Church Road. it appears to us that the town centre change makers see these roads as an easy alternative to accommodate more traffic without reference to consideration of or consultation with those of us living here, the town centre changes aim to attract more visitors, but make no allowances for where the traffic is going to go or park
enough for me a word I would ask that consideration is given to whether the JCB might return to an in-person meeting, as I know my residents would be keen to be able to participate in a more meaningful way.
in my view, PR too, is not done and dusted. It is an ongoing issue. It has removed some traffic from the town centre, but tonight I would welcome discussion of the best solutions to some of the key issues which I think for into two camps. The first is the impact on residents living adjacent to, and roads close by to the top end of Mount, Pleasant. What can be done to minimise the inconvenience to them, what can be done to further reduce traffic and how do we tackle traffic displacement, along with other related longstanding traffic problems, such as speeding and pollution?
The second issue is reducing the number of motorists who unwittingly find themselves in the restricted area. I understand the signage is compliant, so what more can be done to indicate that they should avoid driving through this area? The Town Forum has done good work to make suggestions and so have residents this evening.
I hope the committee will agree that we need to make progress and support collaboration between Tunbridge Wells and Kent colleagues to implement improvements, short term and long term
as Tunbridge Wells representative, that we do need guidance from a highways authority as to how to move forward, what is possible and what is not. We are already looking at what Tunbridge Wells might be able to do when it's there, and I look forward to the discussion. Many thanks,
Justin
so on I'll hand over to
John Strachan, who is the Bar Council's parking manager, for an update from John
John August, before I hand over to justice, to clarify the update we asked for this GTB was was around the piling enforcement, so that's what John will be speaking on,
but obviously Members we can. we can discuss more broadly, but just to explain that that's the basis on which Johnby are reporting to us this evening.
creating chair. yes to take a view on the numbers of penalty charges notices issued from the 1st of April up until today,
25,373 is a number.
thank you, John.
do you have any information on?
I guess the trends with a number of people.
certainly, as severe as we can be monitoring, we we monitor the figures daily.
and they are reducing each week,
so that the trend is downwards when we first started. looking at numbers coming through,
there were certainly in excess of a thousand vehicles a day coming through
the restriction the restriction had been in place for a couple of years in in in signing.
and as you will appreciate during during the pandemic.
enforcement was
suspended,
we commenced issuing warning notices.
on the 20th, 20th of February this year, and we should in the region of about 18,000 over over a two month period or just under two months.
period actually, February March, yes, it's February 20th February, until the 31st of March that we issued warnings.
but yes, certainly, though, there is a visible trend downwards,
which is hovering above 200 vehicles a day at the moment.
thank you. John
so, members, I have to you and you have any questions,
Joan or any other officers on the go.
Councillor Roberts,
a job.
salye mentioned earlier, however, Department of Transport guidance.
was to question the effect of this, but by monitoring the penalty notice, so very shame, if this crucially high is to review the screen less immediately, what's Easter is, do we know what that trigger would be?
it is obviously risky was sited at 350 per day now, it's it's 261 seems quite a high amount of vehicles to be compared to what they to traffic travels before you do we know what the tribute would be to to review it.
it's probably helpful to explain the arrangements around PR to
somebody else Borough Council act as the agents of Kent County Council in carrying out the enforcement
and
Kent County Council have given notice that they will take enforcement in house themselves from the 1st of April 2024.
these sorts of schemes take a long time to settle down.
it's interesting that last year there was a change in the legislation that allowed
county councils to take on moving traffic offences and if Kent County Council, which would take on that responsibility, we're implementing as a band no right turn or a similar sort of restriction.
the data give six months of warning notices that the requirement within the legislation is for six months or warning notices to be given,
which is interesting, because
that that is what the Department for Transport probably suggests this sort of time that it takes for one of these schemes to bed in.
and I certainly know from
advice from Kent County Council that they would probably look at a scheme for a year before they thought that any significant reviews.
John doesn't.
of your question, Councillor.
I appreciate what John said, I suppose, but the if the guidance insists. the patient issues is disproportionately high, it's just not sickly what the team does portly higher shine are at their consciences, is one point which I consider let's review, I appreciate fully what John says about targeting bagging in order
to.
yeah, I don't know I mean I had we saw me forward
with this because the the this city batting backwards and forwards and there were the residents
trying to get in touch with Tunbridge Wells and KCC and been passed from one to the other,
so I'm not too sure,
what we can do to improve this situation expires and by the year on the commonest we find the saving.
I know it's not a question necessary for John
on estate.
I said
just
unless in the chair thanks Prater
at this moment, sorry, this is purely a Tunbridge Wells Borough Council skate, Kent county council does not have any control, but this game I wrote the Director of Highways asking them if we could to say
because of the mess, there was regarding fine, the Charles tribes, no no, but Covic cetera, and I have a written response to direct reply by telling me that the town's Tunbridge Wells Borough Council, Tunbridge Wells Borough Council reap the benefits of this game, all of the fines go into the coffers.
it swelled their budget, nor can county councils and until the
the the on-street parking rules change which is another at some time it treads 24 KCC cannot intervene, KCC maybe signage, and if some signage were created and that is down to KCC, but it's only Tunbridge Wells council the scheme and just to the changing highway lie,
I have to go in and have courts charged with crisis say the Greek,
but the fines and collection of fines Tunbridge Wells Borough Council could stop tomorrow, should they wish to do so, so just not by clear, because it is not a decision, OK, 6 H x
Chair, if I could just respond on those points.
we were contacted by Kent County Council
midway through last year.
saying that they were starting up their own
camera enforcement team and they would be taking on
Powers from government to carry out moving traffic fence enforcement and they told us at the same time that it was their intention to take. public realm and public realm to enforcement in house around about October 2022,
they then contacted us
between times and said that they weren't in a position
to take on the camera enforcement at that time and that they would take on the camera enforcement in from the 1st of April 2023.
in February 2023 January, February 2023 Kent County Council contacted us
and asked us to.
re-employment, enforcement of public realm to
as soon as possible,
which we did in February with a warning now to scheme, so it is a scheme that Kent County Council intends taking on next year and, at their request, we implemented at the beginning of this year.
Kent County Council is the highway authority by default are responsible for enforcement.
of a public realm to through an agency agreement with us.
so I said,
as my guest said.
how did so devoted to Tunbridge Wells Borough Council, whatever the response says paint as far KCC cannot stop you making that charge at this moment in time, and I have that in writing so down to Tunbridge Wells Borough Council at this moment until 2024, when KCC take on string, parking enforcement can then make the decision whether or not I wish to keep it or take it away, but case Tunbridge Wells it, I did not want to make these charges could stop making them tomorrow is purely a Tunbridge Wells decision.
I can go back and get that letter sent back to Tunbridge Wells, that's what you need, but
it is most the Tunbridge Wells, this tension at this time.
I consider Councillor canals and is an
and takes a and
I concern sorry, I'm a bit hoarse my concern and, if feel full cement, simply stop, we just said anyone can use drive through that area, we have got a safety issue with at the crossing of Munson Road, at the junction, amount plus one where a previous traffic island was removed to start scheme, so I think it's a great concern.
if we were to simply stop in force, and my main point is and the tastings that Councillor Ruckland mentioned about trying to improve the situation for residents and also making it much clearer to drivers today is
a restricted area, do we have to wait
for six months before we can do anything or is that work that the two councils working together can actually do now that will lead to those improvements because I thought the residents spoke very powerfully and actually came up with 10 suggestions of how I could better thank you.
thank you, Councillor, I think we're all said.
anyone else wish to
comment
Councillor McKenna,
he if you
yeah, we currently don't you me?
there's such an
yes, just like serious crime, so so, chancellor talk that sorry,
the residents to say sorry Parsons.
you know if the screen can't be totally reversed because.
the islands are in the US, opposes has been revived since
then, I'd like to hope that
the
suggestion put forward by residents totally ritual crowds
we have got to go
around child will be because it really is
very, very silly, while the skeins oppressive moments and not study but serve as they say
costly
and sense time.
and many departments and such men, so too are to businesses as well, so
hopefully the two councils will
not wait, so April next year,
very quickly
try to results, since we were proper consultation with councillors, residents and between the offices, thank you very much.
thank you, Councillor McMullen and Councillors.
yeah, thank you very much. I mean, it's obvious that we've got to listen to the
the residents
I mean, it's it's we were here on their behalf anyway.
and it's of great concern to them and the traders
in the in the town centre.
to make this work and weakens to four just to Councillor, unfortunately
and.
there's too much work has been done
physically,
for
just to have a.
to have no restrictions to
clearly there needs to be
consultation has and has been stated.
and I'm glad that the residents
such great and thoughtful ideas about this, I know the traders have, especially in
Munson Road.
because the the
so affected world as we had physically affected.
by cars driving into blocks, and
you know
it's always easy to say that something has to be done, but something does have to be done to solve this and to elsewhere
have a problem with people not coming into the town centre as soon as we heard at once
snowballs.
we're in trouble, so really something
we need to listen and and then act most definitely, thank you very much.
thank you, Councillor.
Councillor Roberts,
I think we are all in agreement that something needs to be done, and I'm just wondering
by yourself on the offset,
do we move this forward?
yes, asking a question, I mean my or my immediate thoughts as we're going to
by Councillor Wakefield very early on in the call is a budgetary situation, can County Council and,
as we know, timetables for councils know not particularly
better position?
I wonder I guess from perhaps we can put this to the officers,
I think the president spike very well and came and I'm very, very constructive in their suggestions,
so you know it is, there is a scape of Lee, one of the residents suggested that some of the
revenue from the scheme could go towards.
some some remediation for the for for you can Dudley Road in particular.
so perhaps
on a technical level.
John is or is not something that could be a possibility that some of the revenue generated by the scheme could go towards improvements.
I can speak on how the revenue could be used,
what I would say is that any changes to the scheme,
in whatever form,
would need to be done by Kent County Council, where we're just really caretakers in this.
yeah, I mean well, I mean we did, on which we were very involved in the
I mean it is a scheme that we
proposed
at a number of years ago
I appreciate the point of making
the public realm was was,
I was was.
possible
planning for the town centre.
if there are any changes
envisaged so proposed to the highway or the layout or accessibility to certain groups.
directions of flow of traffic, closing off of roads that will be matters for the highway authority, it's not something that Tunbridge Wells officers would want to comment on really
okay.
I know we haven't Julian you, I know it's not your remit, so I don't wanna put you on the spot with an
any any comments on that.
I mean, I think I do think that we've had some very clear indication from the residents about what they would like,
I also said the enforcement has had an impact on the number of vehicles passing through the area, which is which is the aim of it, so
I think that is also good news and I think it seems like
the the impact on on local residents and perhaps also businesses is it's the remaining?
the critical thing for the scheme, and I hope that you know between us, two authorities, we can
look at the the very practical and reasonable proposals put forward by the residents.
thank you, yeah, let's try to keep the common tree in the in the meeting if we can sorry because the chap meeting Chair, I don't think, is available for the minutes, but Councillor McInroy has just yeah has just pointed out the need for proper consultation I think we
recognised
anything further Members Councillor O'Connor.
yes, Councillor Robert said,
it does seem that it's still sloping left up in the air and I won't.
if, as a first step,
possibly the borough councillors.
kaftan and Park, together with Councillor Becky Brunel. could actually sit down with the residents, who suggested improvements and actually try and put something together. so I take
Mr. Strachan's point that as Tunbridge Wells Borough Council can't actually implement any highway improvements or changes, but I just feel the moment where we sort of powerless to do anything and to actually improve the situation for restaurants
and stop people paying,
you know find because they've made a mistake so I'm just desperately trying to think the way forward that we actually make progress on this.
thank you, Councillor is yeah, so I think it's Councillor McKenna is
area,
thankfully I'm also considering I might not be interested as well.
we did and just for context as well we did at the last GTB, we did agree, the
a proper review of the scheme would be more prepared after
12 months to allow it to
to bed in, but equally I did say at that meeting that this came to gender rather light and the residents didn't have enough time to register to speak at that meeting, so I really appreciate presents taking time this evening to
come to meeting and as, as I mentioned, I think with some really practical proposals.
so I think.
think economy, perhaps we can as the JCB. and
pass a motion on that, but I think I think that's a very sensible idea.
we are in a list of tangible proposals, we we should be able to, as two authorities get together to look at options,
I thank you for clarifying Councillor McAvoy's, yes, I see yourself and come spring.
OK.
I don't think there's anything else left other than to thank the residents very much for for coming.
as I said, I really appreciate that
constructive,
your constructive suggestions for us, I think there's a lot of food for thought
for us as far and County Councillors.
next agenda item.
is on red-brick footways,
so Gillian Cooke
KCC Highways Manager will present his report on this
thank you, Chair. Yes, this is an update on KCC's commitment to maintaining the rate for boys in Tunbridge Wells and you'll see from the report this to mine
if you like, benefits out of this report the first one. Despite the current financial challenges that have already been discussed, the KCC phase we have ring-fenced some funding for red brick, improvements to undertake highway improvements on the footways
and the first project being identified in this financial year is Upton St Johns Road between the Leisure Centre and the romesco, and second, one is following and a number of concerns from residents and councillors regarding the removal of red brick areas following infill development for vehicle crossovers, driveways etc into people's properties
the process will be amended from the 1st of Jan 2024 that if you are currently on a red brick footway and you apply for a vehicle crossover drop kerb, and that, rather than it being tarmac or concrete, which for the previous options that moving forward,
the requirement will be that the red brick is used. some enhance and maintain as much of the red brick footways as we can in the town,
I don't know if there's any questions from members seemed like a wet report, and if there are any questions, I'd be happy to answer.
thank you, Julian and Cosmogramma.
thank you, Chairman. and sexually much to Julien cocaine.
his colleagues for their excellent
reports and
the progress.
long wait for a very good news on the cross.
yeah, the from
thinking. from
first, in January last year, that
they will.
we actually
can use the new
breaks, but still
Tom Cross service will be constructed with new
is right,
so where we have paying and where we are currently
one question.
Julian Cope
was with regards to
future Trevor
Curtis clarified that if
funding is tight.
yeah priorities
would it be possible?
for Costa has been chopped so so.
no applied should be replaced with new tricks, as I say.
yeah, because it's not my raising
report,
thank you very much.
thank you, Councillor, yes, I'm obviously for the new application the requirement would be that it be made out of red brick, there are obviously opportunities for any residents that have happened in the past, that is tarmac, that they could so wish to apply again and have changed over to red brick, obviously it would be at their cost
or we might find some people that come forward and want to do that to maintain. and enhance the environment that they live in,
but ultimately we will not be able to force retrospectively people who have had it in the past, but the option will be there that if they wanted to come forward and pay for it to be changed red-brick that would be available.
thank you very much.
Mr. Cook, thank you.
councils.
chancellor and Councillor exit
thanks Peter
Gillian, absolutely superb news, and something that a lot of people have been asking for for a long time. Long-time. My only concern would be both quality assurance. Can we as crazy say, as Highways Tunbridge Wells
puts over the companies that the residents my grinning to redo the, because if it's not done properly, as we say, with a number of utility companies doing right,
it could very soon break up or become tripping has a look at the polling, so the quality of the work needs to be maintained if they're going to put dropped curbs in to access driveways. So I just wonder how we could manage that, how we can make sure that this the right standard
thank you, Councillor, for a very good point. I is one of the reasons why we're looking at implementing it from the 1st of Jan 24. I we're just currently finishing off the specification for that that requires a deeper debts in terms of a sub base.
So as a result of that, all the contractors that will be required to work on it will all have the necessary highway highway certificates to work on the public highway. The works themselves will then be checked by us and we're looking at an extended warranty period that there will be the responsibility of that householder stroke, the companies that they use for that period currently at the moment, that same applies for a tarmac crossover that if they went to a certain company as long as I've got the street work tickets, that company could do the work again, we check that work and it is checked again at a later date after 12 months, to ensure that it's still satisfactory and we'd be looking at that similar process. For the red bricks, but we are enhancing the sub-base to ensure so that it's a deeper depth when using the red bricks to ensure that quality in the long term on the longevity of that crossover is there.
clearly, answers that
it does brilliant, thank you.
thank you, John and I had the same question actually. councillors,
thank you Chair, I have got a similar question about quality
in the
the the need to specify.
the type of brick used,
there are bricks and mortar bricks on it, I mean the this, there's a danger of a slip hazard as well, some some bricks
when they become wet.
to present the slip hazard
and also need to protect against frost
as well, and also.
but, as we know, Tunbridge Wells is a particular term which is one of the joys of it
there needs where the particular red
appears across the rest of Tunbridge Wells as well, so.
surely we need to take that into account as well, thank you very much.
thank you, Councillor yeah, that's included within the specification. We're looking at using the Keswick bricks which are the ones that used on St John Road since John Road down in the deer park area. It's it's the standard red brick that we use when we're doing the footways, and that would be part of the specification that's requirement to use those bricks, so we're not going to have lots of various different types of red bricks. Obviously they're not going to be a perfect match for the original clay bricks, but what we'll be doing is taking away those clay bricks from those jobs and storing them in our yard to use for the small local maintenance jobs that we've got moving forward when we remove the red bricks just to give you an indication between around 30 40% of them when we uplift the too damaged to be put back so we're looking around about a 60 65% retention rates on on those red bricks we get when we do works ourselves or on these crossovers that we then returned to us as the Highway Authority for maintenance purposes, but within that specification will be a particular break that is required to be used, so we're not going to be allowing anybody just to go and use any standard house bricks or anything like that for example,
we didn't.
number any further comments or questions.
if I may then add my
congratulations really to Lisa
and since before means really.
Denise and Gillian, we have managed to have managed to put aside some funding towards this
and
I think,
undoubtedly, the household deceiver
introducing crossovers.
noticing a sizeable gain in the value of their property, so I think it's a very
smarts idea to
to to introduce that requirements
when, when, really for both the Council and for the residents.
I had one observation just round the impact of
cars parking on on the red bricks,
and he mentioned about electric vehicles as well additional way. You are maybe just coming a little further on that, Julian an impact of that and potential mitigations.
Yeah certainly I'm one of the issues we're aware with the current red bricks, we've got one because of the age of them, so nobody, when ever constructed ever expected vehicles to be parking on them as a result. That's why we're amending the specification for that extra depth to give the strengths of those vehicles and to accommodate the additional weight of the electric vehicles. As we know it, I was significantly more and I are causing damage on some of the existing footways around the town where people park on their we understand why people park on the footway is restricted well, but as time moves on and more electric vehicles come on line. That is going to be an issue, moving forward that we will have in terms of a maintenance burden. KCC but it's one that this time we're preparing for it in terms of that specification, the only reasons where we may have the odd one in tarmac in the future just to give you a sort of a heads up on it, is if we have got some statutory equipment utility equipment such as water pipes that are close to the surface and they possibly should be. It may not be possible because of extra depth in certain locations to get that, but certainly from the initial surveys were expecting that to be very rare.
OK, thank you, and any mentioned ground here because of tree roots, presumably that this is isn't the same principle with cars as in the Parkham, one part, and they displace other parts of the pavement
yes, essentially that one as excited as I am manoeuvring on the footway, it's not so much the parks wait a bit, although that can have an impact, it's the manoeuvring on it that the brick footways when they were constructed around the town so say when never expected to have the weights and loads that are put on them now and it's why one of the things I say and again with the not just the the design of the vehicle crossovers but the design of the red brick improvement works like we've done on the other side of St John's Road again that specification takes into account that additional weight pressure that's not happening on the on those footways when vehicles drive on them.
thank you.
and I don't see any further questions or comments, and the said reports are knighting and we have been donated.
now I greed.
thank you, Julian.
and now we move on to the highways works programme.
so again, I'll hand over to Julian to introduce this.
thank you Chair. This is the generic report that comes to every JCB. I'm not going to go through page by page, it's really just or are there any questions at this stage? The one thing I would say is the update from the previous report that came back in April is, we've now got all the footway schemes on there, one of which, of course we've just discussed which St John's Road brick improvements
that's the only real addition from last time, the rest of it's just an update of the progress of where we're happening with the various planned schemes. So if there's any questions I'll be happy to answer
unless
Councillor L,
despite Councillor Munday.
just about the matzo word Mr. Wright, design process, as it's noted it's due to start just wondering when we can expect the first design to be ready for review by the residents.
to Council, which pages that on Sundays 37.
developer funded works, yeah Gillian.
what I'll have to do Councillor is come back to you on that one, that's actually looked by my colleagues in the agreements team, I'm not passing the buck at, but to get the specific details on that, I'll have to come back to you separately on that one if that's OK yeah, that's fine, thank you.
then
heads Councillor McConkey, next.
thank you very much and page 27 Western Road surfacing,
which is carried out or partly carried out last weekend or last week, but I think he cracked, but it was cancelled in the end, or a large part of it is cancelled due to the closure of bats who rode,
due to water works and you confirm and let me know when you're likely to revisited to finish off the works, but obviously you have to go away and have a chat with someone, I suspect thank you
or certainly worked out slog at that too.
thank you, Julian
members, anything further.
not
coming for my answers, OK Julian,
so, page 37,
I know it's St John's Road or bus stop a new access for residential developments, I was overjoyed not to see the two words bellmouth, but before the word access.
and I will revisit the the bellmouth junction discussions, but this in particular is very heavily trafficked by pedestrian roads, one section of road
and also a wide highway, which I believe would
permit us not to use it belmar in fact I would say we should not. introduce bellmouth junction because of the impact that will detrimental impact on haven't pedestrians
compared to the
the the ability to manoeuvre in the in the in the wide highway, so would you mind just kind of going back and checking that that wasn't just a an emission and the the the the is a a new tights mouth access as opposed to bellmouth access?
yeah, I mean as a single chair, there's been a lot to discuss exchange she played over the last couple of years, unless there still is the requirement, obviously.
for certain vehicles, refuge vehicles, fire engines, etc that still require a turning circle of getting in. what I can tell you, I mean I'm not sure of the specific arrangements, so of that junction again dealt with by the agreements team,
but whenever they do these they try to narrow down the junctions as much as possible, but there still needs to accommodate certain vehicles going in and out of the site so
yeah, I think if he perhaps could come back to me on how we appreciate and certainly
can't stress yeah,
OK. so I don't see any further Hands Up Oasis, so
we will
move on, then say thank you Julian.
so final agenda item tonight is topics for future meetings, members, so do any members wish to put forward a topic for feature
JCB meeting?
searches for national nature
that you think we should have.
it's not a future topic that I'm going to look at the background to giving we should,
I don't, and it's generous but ominous I'll speak to Councillor Hamilton, there's a niche, I think
yeah, I agree, I think it's alive, it's a lie scheme and we did discuss.
the IPU, JCB or you know, if nothing else, a quarterly update on just enforcement and numbers of people using it, but I think also it allows it does give us a forum for residents to have a dialogue which,
I am not aware of other forms that exist for that, so
I would agree with with Councillor, thank you.
anything, the members.
so from my side there's just something that's come up fairly recently and also given we've been talking about crossovers,
so a number of reasons have been in touch around the
process of applying for a vehicle access to to a property.
so using front gardens for driveways and then dropped kerb and vehicular access and to properties and
which authority this sits with whether it's Kent County Council to assure us Borough Council the answer
is both which I think is is part of the reason that residents often get confused
so and towards per consuming is responsible for,
the planning permission for the driveway and in Kent County Council is responsible for planning, permission or approving the dropped kerb on highways grounds,
but I think it's a topic for featured JCB because it is fairly technical, but I did speak to Councillor Hampson, we agreed that perhaps a kind of an advisory note might be circulated just so that if councillors if you do get this on the doorstep or from residents contacting you then then your forearms, with it,
I think, and one reason a couple of resents, particular sort of been so concerned about the lost parking space on the main road because of converting front gardens to driveways,
so I think it's I think it would be helpful for us all to try well apprised of that so that we know
what the what the the the processes in which authority deals with which part of it really.
Chair
before my suggestion, what I can do is send a link to the ways in terms of KCC, which has all the requirements and the details of the the required dimensions for crossover.
so it's got all the technical details that then can be passed around the members of the board, but yes, just one thing I wanted to clarify was temperatures per councillor, the planning authority for it, if they didn't can, information for crossover, does not automatically mean that that resident will get that crossover KCC then have to do the technical check to inquire or the dimensions of the sightlines are there. So whilst in theory Tunbridge Wells Borough Council can say yes on a road, we give the planning permission, it still needs to come to the Highway Authority for that technical check, and that's what we do is a technical check, and it's those details which I can then forward to the members of the board. So they can say the requirements that KCC look at,
I think thank you to him,
yes and Councillor Stephen are coming on this
year, I think
I say. as a very interesting area I did I said I have
electric vehicle street, on-street charging Embry and as this few hundred vehicles that
the company would need on street
charging points about the charges and but obviously equally side.
to encourage people to have electric vehicles they want to be able to charge them, and so the you know that joint waste being converted potentially being converted into
well, from ha ha garden, to to a drive to allow them to charge the originally conceived is the way forward.
in supporting either climate action say because we call for their for the residents suspect,
but it is gonna be an interesting.
extensive debate going forward on and challenge me there is on loss of parking, but also supporting evades and interesting interesting dynamics
Councillor
yeah, so that's really I think it's really helpful, I think, just even knowing what the were it, what with what each authority does, I think is is is particularly helpful and also what the
well the planning
lower is 4 comma 2 hours per Council as well, and so we make sure that circulated, and that's a good point as well. Councillor Roberts around electric vehicle charging,
which undoubtedly is probably behind a significant significant number of these conversions, neither
OK.
thank you any other hands or essays so.
I think all that remains for me to do, then, is members, thank you. time this evening, thank you to members of the public that came and spoke as well.
and
our next meeting is scheduled to take place on Monday, 2nd October, at 6 p.m.
We will try to make it a hybrid meeting,
so
which would be good.
be able to meet largely face-to-face and give the residents a chance to.
come
on and meet us face to face as well, so been online for quite a while, but we are going to try to move to hybrid.
on a and thank you everyone for your time saving
and I will bring meeting.
- 1 Apologies for Absence, opens in new tab
- 2 Declarations of Interest, opens in new tab
- 3 Notification of Persons Wishing to Speak, opens in new tab
- JTB Minutes FINAL 30012023, opens in new tab
- JTB - 17 April 2023 - Minutes final, opens in new tab
- 230628_JTB Report July 2023_hs, opens in new tab
- Appendix A - High_Street_Tunbridge_Wells_Plan, opens in new tab
- 7 Update on Public Realm, opens in new tab
- Red Brick footway report. Tunbridge Wells JTB.. July 2023.REV1, opens in new tab
- Tunbridge Wells Highway Works Programme Report 3rd July 2023, opens in new tab
- 9 Topics for Future Meetings, opens in new tab
- 10 Date of the Next Meeting, opens in new tab